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When and Where Are the 316’rs?

By docarzt,

  Filed under: Easter Eggs
  Comments: 69

The opening to “The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham” was on par with some of the season premieres as far as the sense of mystery it evoked.  Initially it seemed to be taking place somewhere off island, perhaps Mrs. Hawking’s office – more so, it suggested that Ceaser and Ilana maybe coverts working for ‘somebody,’ perhaps an intentional wink to the various fan theories floating around.  Ultimately, what the scene did accomplish is a slight indication of when the 316’rs were – roughly.  Didn’t notice it?  Read on.

The 316 crash landed on Hydra island, and the building Caeser was looting was an office in the Hydra station – this much was revealed by the logo on the files.  Some of the pages inside of the files revealed that the 316’rs are somewhere in the future.  The clues were some photocopies of documents we’ve seen before.


The image on the left is from “The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham,”  and on the right is the same page from season 4.  The page is from Faraday’s notebook.  As we know, in the current timeline Faraday has his notebook.  This clears up the question of whether the 316 folks are in the same timeline as Sawyer, Jack, and company.  The only question from here is, how far into the future are they?

  • Charlie’s Ghost

    They don’t necessarily have to be in the future. They could very easily be in the past, and Faraday could have already spent three years with Dharma, hiding his notebook in the office where Caesar was searching.

    • The 316ers landed on the Hydra Island runway. Once again, Ben’s knowledge of things to come is uncanny.

      • dolce

        Maybe it is knowledge provided by Jacob.

  • Hipster Doofus

    I think it was established when they showed the abandoned beach camp, Ajira bottles, those boats, Vincent’s old collar, that we are in the future. But they’re not really in the future. They are in the present in the same way that Alpert and Co. are in the present. They are simply 3 years (or however much linear time has passed since the O6 left) in the future. They are on Hydra Island in 2007. That’s really the only time that makes any sense at all.

    • LV


    • imfromthepast

      exactly correct.

    • Ed Holden

      I think 2008ish is a relatively good estimate. In other words, only Jack, Kate and Hurley time traveled. Sun and the rest of the plane didn’t (or they time traveled only to the extent one always does when crossing the barrier around the island).

      I does look to me like Frank managed to land the plane on the Hydra runway Kate and Sawyer helped build. The scene with the plane is at night, but you can see that it’s run into the brush alongside a cleared strip.

      • Mr. Rob

        I agree that they landed on the runway. In the screen cap aval. on this site you see the jet in one piece.

        It was nice to see one of my theories pan out in this sense. I just wish my Medusa Spider theory had paned out in the same way. But it does answer my question I posed in the forums as to why Locke had no hang marks around his neck.

        • rick

          how’d they land safely and that many people get hurt?

  • tonymcnitt

    When you say “As we know in the current timeline that Jeremy has his notebook” do you mean the actor Jeremy Davies, and you meant to say Faraday?

  • JaySin420

    It seems to me from tonight and next wk preview that the O6 minus Sun are stuck in the past (Dharma time) with Faraday, Sawyer, etc while the 316ers along w Ben, Locke n Sun are in the present. I don’t see any reason to think its the future, Faraday or someone else could have just photographed the notebook in the past. I was thinking it’d be funny if Locke ends up on that outrigger boat chasing after and shooting at himself and his pals.

    • LV

      I think you have it right (although I’m not positive Ben and Sun are in the same time as Locke – or did they show them together in the preview for next week’s ep?). Locke and the other 316ers are, at the moment, in the same time as they were off the island – 2007.

      • stweedle

        Ben not in the same time as Locke? Didn’t Caesar bring Locke to the place where the injured folks were and Ben was laying there on a cot.

        • hyperRevue

          Ben and Locke are cleary in the same time. Sun, we don’t know. But I don’t see why she wouldn’t have been sent back in time with the rest of the 06. Who Lipidus ran off with is quite the mystery.

          • Lindsay

            I was left with the impression that Lapidus probably left with Sun, but is Sayid?

          • hyperRevue

            I don’t see why Sun and Sayid wouldn’t travel back with Jack, Hurley and Kate.

          • I agree.

            > Who Lipidus ran off with is quite the mystery.

            THAT’s the big Mistery of 5.07!

          • docarzt

            I believe he ran off with Sun. He knows that Jin is alive now, and will want to help her be reunited.

          • hyperRevue

            But why don’t you think Sun would have been whooshed away with the other 06? Why is she different?

          • hyperRevue

            Doc – But why don’t you think Sun would have been whooshed away with the other 06? What makes her different?

          • hyperRevue

            Oops. Sorry. The first time I entered it I got the “wrong captcha” error.

  • CorrosionX

    They would need to be in the future because they drank all the Dharma beer from the Lostie beach camp.

    • dolce

      If this is a joke, lol. If not, I wouldn’t think that after returning to the wierdest place on earth, and all the drama before and after, that a Dharma beer beach party would be a priority. Why are there people out there that think whoever came in the canoes drank the beer moments before Sawyer and crew arrive?

      • dolce

        oops …would not be a priority…

  • Zetaprime

    Ben is definitely in the same timeline as Locke. At the end of this week’s episode Locke is led to the bed where we see an injured Ben sleeping, and he comments that Ben was the man who murdered him.

  • Steven

    They’re not in the future. They’re in the present. Flight 316 crashed in 2008 because that’s when the plane took off. (Early 2009 at the latest) The O6 were zapped back in time to the 70s for the Dharma Initiative, while the rest of the plane crashed, as usual, on the Hydra Island in the present. If you notice, they said the captain and a woman took one of the pontoon boats…likely travelling to base camp of our Losties. They more than likely found a zodiac raft there, and well…you get the idea.

    What I’m most curious about is the woman with Lapidus. The only woman it could possibly be that we KNEW was on the plane is Sun, but since she’s one of the six, one would assume she transported back in time with the rest of em. So, there must have been SOME woman that we know, but didn’t know was on the plane there. Someone Lapidus also knew. That only leaves Penny from the information we currently have.

    Good catch though on the Hydra…I remembered the symbol but didn’t put two and two together they were on the other island.

    • Nicole

      It could have been the flight attendant (if she survived that beating the plane gave her) I’ve seen someone comment in another forum that we’ve seen her before as the Oceanic Airlines spokeswoman or something

    • hyperRevue

      I think that’s right. 316 are in the “present” and the 06 got whooshed back in time.

    • dolce

      Agreed- future to the left behinders, present day to the o6.

  • boonesghost

    A great episode, but how long was Locke hanging there before someone found him? Judging by the length of Jack’s beard when he visits the funeral home compared to when Locke is in the hospital after the accident, I’d say a month. I thought Darlton had a team that kept up with beard continuity…

    • LV

      Well, we don’t know how much time passed while Locke was out visiting all the O6ers. Couldn’t Jack’s beard have grown during that time? (I don’t know – I haven’t been following the progress of Jack’s beard in comparison to the rest of the timeline lately, lol.)

  • clueless1der

    And another question: how do they get back to all being in the same time again?

    • DHARMA Agent

      “And another question: Do they get back to all being in the same time again?”

      Fixed. 😉

  • After watching this episode last night I had a dream I was Jack and that was thanking everyone for returning to the Island, even Desmond, I also remember Me/”Jack” crying about it since he was so happy. It was very weird.

  • Will

    On Beard Continuity: We don’t know precisely how much time passed between Locke and Jack’s conversation and Locke’s suicide attempt…

    • dolce

      LOL! Beard continuity. That’s hilarious.

  • boonesghost

    I got the impression Locke had just gotten out of the hospital. He was still bruised and scabby looking.

    • Lindsay

      I got the same impression, but I was a bit confused because Ben said that Jack bought a ticket, singular. In the flashforward at the end of “Through the Looking Glass” Jack said that he had been flying, and I got the impression that he’d been taking a whole lot of flights. I was confused because the amount of time between Locke’s suicide and Jack seeing him at the funeral home didn’t seem to jive with some of the flying dialogue.

      • LV

        Except that Ben could have been lying. Not that he’s known for that.

  • Sam

    So if they are on the Hydra island, does that mean the plane landed on the landing strip they were making?

    • hyperRevue

      I like that idea a lot – that they were building the runway for 316.

      But the plane appeared to have crashed in some trees. Do we have screen caps of when Ceasar and Locke walk past the wreckage?

      • Lindsay

        There are screencaps that Doc Arzt posted last night (I believe). I noticed that when Ilana and Cesar were walking by the plane the ground they were walking on was very black, and it didn’t seem to look that way because it was at night. I could easily see it as the runway they were building in Season 3.

        • hyperRevue

          Yeah, I just saw those. I really couldn’t make anything out of them.

          • blzftr

            I was looking at the screencaps too. It looks like people are standing on the runway, but that the plane veered off into some trees.

      • The runway may not have been completed. For the plane to remain as intact as it was in the episode, it would need a somewhat unhindered path to come to a rest without breaking apart horribly.
        I’ve been excited about the runway/316 connection since the Ajira viral sites, since the “why” of the runway was something that always stuck with me 🙂

  • hyperRevue

    Okay – food for thought.

    The 06 are back in Dharma’s early days. We know that.

    So, will they meet a young Ben Linus? Will they try and prevent the purge (do they even know about the purge? We know Locke does). Is that their fate – to stop Ben from killing everyone? Or, do the 06 die in the purge and is that the endgame?

    • Mandeville

      Locke told Hurley about Ben’s role in the purge while he was digging around in the corpses’ jumpsuits. I think that was season 4?

  • hyperRevue

    Also – Christian/Jacob told Locke to find Hawking and it was that revelation that prompted Ben to kill Locke.

    But Hawking had Locke’s suicide note. How did she get it? Did Ben give it to her? Why would Ben give it to her but not want him to meet her?

  • Steven

    I see one of two things. Either there is some “rule” to this whole deal that says you can’t be resurrected if you kill yourself and Ben knew about it, OR Ben knew it didn’t matter how Locke dies as long as he does, so he talked him down to find out every bit of info he knew first.

    • Mandeville

      Ben just needed a last bit of info (Hawking’s name) before Ben died. He knew that Ben had to die and that suicide would sit better with the 06 than a murder. Ben would be the obvious suspect for a murder.

      The question is why did hearing Hawking’s name flip the switch for Ben. Is it because he didn’t know she was involved or because he was surprised that John knew. Remember how pissed Ben was when he found out Jacob talked to Johan previously? I have to assume Ben knew only Jacob would have given John that information. Ben and Jacob have an antagonistic relationship more than the leader/follower one hinted at earlier in the show.

  • Lockology

    Hurley knows of the purge and if hurley knows everyone knows

    • hyperRevue

      Oh, right. He does.

      So, the 06 can’t change the future. Because if they stop the purge, then the Natives never take over and then there is no need for the 815 to crash and for the 06 to travel back in time.

      So, I guess the 06 are destined to die in the purge. Assuming they don’t turn the wheel again and whoosh somewhere else.

      • imfromthepast

        You are assuming the Losties that have joined DHARMA, Jin being the only one we know of, but we can assume the rest did, will stay on DHARMA’s side. For all we know they are the ones that Ben is referring to when he says there were others that were a part of DHARMA that didn’t end up in that pit.

        • Alaine

          We have also seen Faraday in Dharma gear. He brushed passed Chang/Halliwax beneath the still under construction Orchid Station in season 5 episode 1.

  • The Mantis

    Jeez, I don’t know…. That was the biggest mystery for me last night, I hear what you’re saying and it makes sense Steven, but the way Ben’s eyes lit up the second Locke said Hawking’s name makes me think she’s more interagral than we think and Locke was never meant to know about her, or plan to see her. That was a crazy scene though, But if Ben does know the “rules”, why would he sincerely tell John he’s going to miss him? Would’nt he know that he’d see him again? I haven’t been confused like this in a while….

  • Nemesise1977

    Ben is a shister(sp?). He knows most the rules but not all and he does not know everything. He needed to know how Locke was going to get back and John spilled it so he killed locke knowing that he didnt need him anymore…alive at least. He prolly thought if he could kill him then the island is done with him and was wrong.

    I am curious how the o6 will get back, I am thinking that turning the wheel to banish widmore also throws them through time again.

    As for how long lock off island I am thinking they time lapsed it alot to make it fit in one epp.

    • hyperRevue

      You think Ben didn’t know of Hawking until Locke told him? I dunno. They sure seemed pretty chummy in the Lamp Post station.

      As far as the 06 getting thrown through time when Widmore is banished. I like that idea a lot.

    • Mandeville

      Ben knows the rules, but he is actively trying to circumvent them. For better or for worse, we don’t know. Remember, there’s nothing that says the island is a force for good.

  • imfromthepast

    Anyone else notice that Locke didn’t identify himself as Jeremy Bentham to Walt? If not, how did Walt know Locke was going by that name when he visited Hurley. The only people that knew Locke and Bentham were one in the same were the O6 and Widmore, and we know Walt didn’t talk to any of the O6…

    • Alaine

      Walt did visit Hurley in the mental hospital. But I seem to remember both Hurley and Walt refer, awkwardly to Locke only as Bentham. Does anyone remember it differently?

  • Steven

    Ben’s gotta know the rules though, I mean…when Jack asks him if Locke is dead earlier in the season, he quickly changes the subject. Not to mention it’s HIS idea to bring John back…that John HAS to go back too. I realize maybe there’s some time for Eloise to tell him this after John’s death…but realistically, there’s not much. He’d have to meet her, convince her to work with him, gather all the info he possibly could, and go and meet Jack the night of the funeral. That’s more info in less time than we get in a jam-packed episode.

  • Kathy

    Not sure if anyone caught this, but the image on the left is NOT in a notebook – and it does not have lines like the notebook page does. Couldn’t there be more than one version/copy of this drawing????

    • dolce

      Maybe this is the page that Daniel will copy into the notebook in some other timeline.

      • LV

        Or it’s a copy of Daniel’s notebook.

        • dolce


  • Kelly

    Remember that Eloise said that if they didn’t have everyone–if the crash situation wasn’t recreated exactly (which we know it couldn’t have been) there could be odd occurrences. One of those odd occurrences could be that Sun ended up in one time with Ben and Locke and Lapidus the others ended up in the past. It would allow the show to keep Jin and Sun apart for awhile longer. And honestly, we don’t know “when” Sayid is yet. I wonder what time Desmond will be in.

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