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Alternate or Parallel? UPDATED!

By WAxelFoley,

  Filed under: Lost News
  Comments: 58

UPDATE! Heath Solo and I recorded a podcast commenting on this post, the replies and other timeline related theories.

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After the first episode this season it seemed to be common parlance to refer to the timeline in which 815 landed as an “alternate” timeline, but Darlton has emphatically stated that these timelines (815 and The Island) are parallel – meaning they are both of equal weight.

At first I accepted this. Subjectively speaking, the characters are experiencing these timelines as if they are the ONLY timeline they have ever lived in.

Then these “deja vu” incidents kept popping up in LA X and in What Kate Does.

My question is this – if the timelines are parallel and equal in weight, then why are these deja vu’s NOT happening on the Island? Save for Juliet communicating, through Miles, that “it worked”, there seem to be no other examples of the 815 timeline bleeding over to the Island timeline.

Futhermore, the events happening in the 815 timeline seem to be occuring before they did in the Island timeline. Most notably Claire and Ethan have their medical adventures on day one instead of later, like on the Island; it is as if the past events of the Island timeline are affecting the future of the 815 timeline.

This leads me to believe that Darlton is misleading us again and the 815 timeline is in fact an “alternate” to the real, established Island timeline.

This may seem like a frivolous examination of the words alternate and parallel, but I think in the over-all arc it has some importance. But I am not sure why. I have some theories but I’d like to hear what the fans out there have to say.

UPDATE! Heath Solo and I recorded a podcast commenting on this post, the replies and other timeline related theories.


W. Axel Foley is the host of The Lost Mythos Theorycast, which will be starting a new podcast – a live listener call in show – this Tuesday at 11:30pm est on Talkshoe.

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  • I don’t think Damon and Carlton would go out of their way to mislead us this late in the game. If one of the timelines was, in fact, alternate, they would have explicitly come out and said so in the “Clearing up Confusion” interview post-premiere. For them to emphatically state, “This is not an alternate timeline, because that lessens it” is a huge clue, not an elaborate ruse.

    Think of it like this – in “Flashes Before Your Eyes” Desmond is exposed to mass quantities of electromagnetism/radiation and his consciouness “splits.” Our survivors have just been exposed to a similar event and are experiencing the same phenomena. My theory is that these deja vu events will continue to happen, as will certain events we saw on-Island. As these events happen, they will “sync” or non-crash 815ers with their on-Island selves.

    • I think this is a very popular theory and seems to be the direction we are headed in. But it still does not answer the question of parallel or alternate. It seems to me that you may believe the Island timeline will be the one that matters in the end. My question is how will the events of the 815 timeline change the Island timeline?

      • I don’t think we’re going to be choosing either timeline, I think we’ll see a convergence of sorts. The non-crash 815 timeline won’t change the Island timeline, but will instead course correct itself to make sure key Island events happen off-Island, leading to a melding of the 2 time lines.

        • greg dharma

          this seems logical, but it’s is only possible if there is a mobius strip-like effect and the losties are able to travel from their present 2007 timeline back to 2004 before the plane even takes off.

    • Ed Holden

      I actually kind of expected them to do this. What we’re seeing is a paradox, also known amongst time travel geeks as a violation of causality. For reference, see the Grandfather Paradox.

      The 815ers used the island to go back to 1977 and change history, creating a new timeline in which their plane didn’t crash. But in doing this they also erased their own time travel, which prevents them from using the nuke and so restores the original timeline … which results in them going back to 1977 and creating a timeline in which their plane didn’t crash.

      And so on. Ad infinitum.

      The most sensible way to show this is to film both resulting timelines. Showing that “whatever happened, happened” would have been consistent with what we’ve seen up to Season Five, but it would have been kinda boring. On the other hand, creating a new timeline would have been very inconsistent and would also have made everything we’ve watched for five years completely irrelevant.

      So they picked a fun way to keep us in the story we’re already invested in, while exploring what happens when you stray from the Novikov principle we’re so used to. Damon and Carlton are not misleading us at all – Damon was right to emphasize that neither timeline is “alternate” because both are equally valid. Both also cancel each other out.

      • Nick Turner


      • W. Axel Foley

        Very nice. I really like your thought process.

      • apackofmonkeys

        What I don’t understand is from the POV of the 2007 on-Island characters (specifically Richard in this example), what actually happened on the Island when Juliet detonated the bomb? Richard stated in “The Incident” that he saw Jack, Kate, etc DIE. We don’t know what he’s talking about at all- we assumed it was probably the bomb at the time, but it could be any other reason. At what point do the timelines deviate from each other? It appears that in both timelines in 1977 (pre-split, so I guess it’s one timeline technically) the characters ATTEMPTED to detonate the bomb, otherwise that woud violate WHH. So what happened at the Swan site from the POV of 2007 Islanders? If they were watching from a hovering helicopter, what did they see happen? Did all the commotion happen, Juliet got pulled down, then suddenly Jack, Kate, etc all vanish at the same time, with no explosion at all? Then Dharma eventually comes back around the Swan site and finishes digging and building the station?
        That’s what I don’t understand, what specific events happened from the POV of the “original” timeline?

        • Ed Holden

          Yes, and I’m confused by Daniel’s POV. What was he thinking? And did his mom get off the island, or is he dead in both timelines?

          • apackofmonkeys

            Good point. Daniel somehow became absolutely convinced that you could change things, a complete 180 from everything he said before. Also, how did he get such specific information in his journal that he knew the exact minute Dr Chang was supposed to arrive at the Orchid? Hopefully we’ll see this season why Daniel came back armed with this knowledge- it really is important to find out what thing off-island is so incredibly informative.

          • Ed Holden

            Here’s what I think happened: while working in Ann Arbor, Daniel took a scenic trip out into the desert. As he sat at a picnic table with his hunting knife, he found himself carving the words NO FATE onto the wooden surface, and pondering what they might mean.

            Next thing you know he rushed back to blow stuff up and prevent Skynet from ever happening. Er, I mean Charlotte’s death. 🙂

  • I think the The Darlton, in an effort to dissuade the large fan-base that yelped at the idea of a “reset,” a redo that would somehow invalidate all the past lives our of beloved characters, are playing word games.

    The two timelines we are seeing cannot be truly parallel unless the Landies are in a present reality, 2010 or at the least 2007, while the Losties struggle with MIB or Jacob (whoever is the real enemy). Which means parallel universes, which means not the same characters.

    I believe the flash-sideways© are our beloved characters in a reality that has/was reset by the Jughead AND something we have yet to see with the reunited Losties. I also believe at the end the deja-vus the characters seem to experience in the new reality will become a full-bore awakening: Jack, Sawboy, Kate, at the least, will become self-aware of what happened in what we can view as the REAL alternate reality. The Island has to be seen as the alternate for us, the fans, to view all those flashbacks and forwards had meaning.

    IT’s the only way The Darlton cannot cheat the audience.

    Unless, of course, the last scene is a flash, then open on Jack’s eye, waking up at the computer, panning to the title “Lost” on screen….

    • At this point it does seem like 815 will give way to the Island, but is there an alternative to this? Could, in fact the Island losties cross over to the 815 timeline at some point?

      • Their consciousnesses will…that’s the deja vu thing going on.

        What happened happened happened.

        Then something else happened…

      • greg dharma

        not without flashing forward.

        • Time travel is hard because in the corporal sense it is impossible. Only through OB – out of body – methods can the trail of time be travelled at will.

          And that’s how at the end all our friendly Landies will be made aware of their Losties reality when that reality is reunited and severed, allowing the sideways reality© to begin.

          When I saw what happened, happened, I mean that Juliet (my love) blew up the bomb – BUT its full effect cannot be realized as long as the reality is disrupted, which it is by Jin, her baby, and Aaron not being on the Island in ’77.

          Something else has to happen, either through Jack or Sawyer or – gasp – Ben doing something to complete Faraday’s scheme. That’s what I mean by “then something else happened.”

          Time travel, alternate realities are hard because the rules have to be played by known physics. Only through the power of the conscience, or soul, can the known rules be abrogated.

          Try to keep up, please.

  • Brian

    Just so you know: Claire’s encounter with Ethan in LA is not happening earlier than it did on the Island. On the ultrasound, the date is October 22, 2004, which is about when Ethan abducted Claire.

    I believe the LA stories will go one of two ways: they are there to show us that hte characters are fated to go to encounter each other, even without the crash, and we’ll see the characters somehow either enter the Island timeline or continue the Jacob vs. MIB conflict off-island; or we’ll see the characters deja vu moments increase until one of them remembers what happened on the Island and then they’ll find a way to go to the Island. The problem is that in this parallel spacetime, the Island is underwater. So, either the war between Jacob and MIB will occur off-island (and where did they go when the core of Jughead exploded?) or somehow the characters will have to go back in time to the Island. My guess is that this will happen through the Lamp Post station. Going back in time would also reveal to us who will be Adam and Eve. So, look for one more event of time/dimension travel.

    • I love the idea of the 815ers going to the Lamp Post. But the slowly remembering thing just seems so played out to me.

      But, the ultrasound date has been stated by Greg Nations (I think it was him) to be a continuity error. Many people have also stated that it may in fact be Claire’s due date, not the date of the ultrasound.

      • Brian

        Interesting about that error. Still, as I watched the last episode, I kept waiting for Kate to suddenly “come to” and remember Claire and Aaron, particularly as she held Aaron’s stuffed animal.

        What bothers me is that we could easily have a few episodes similar to the last one, where each episode is centered on a character or two in the two time lines. Locke is up next week in both. Then we’ll have a Jack episode, a Sawyer episode, a Hurley episode, a Sun and Jin episode… and we’re running out of time!

  • neoloki

    Whakadoo idea…
    It very well could be a Tangent Universe that was born from the paradox that Jughead did and didn’t go off, a la Schrodinger’s cat; It is my belief that season 1 through 5 is the Tangent Universe where The Incident happens and this is part of MIB’s loophole he has used to kill Jacob. Jacob is still alive in the primary universe, the one we are seeing in season 6 and the war coming is going to be over the supremacy of the two time lines. MIB will try to collapse the primary universe into his Tangent, “loophole”, universe thus making IT the primary time line and Jacob will be gone from existence entirely.

    • Aha! I like this very much. It is in keeping with Lost that this whole situation will be flipped. And this would lend credence to the 815 timeline.

      • greg dharma

        wow, this actually makes total sense. good job, faraday!

    • Casey

      I like this but have one question. If Jacob is “still alive in the primary universe,” then where is he? The Island is under water post-jughead (we think). Is Jacob just renting a giant foot in L.A.?

      • Cutter XXIII

        In the primary universe, Jacob is a Sea Monkey.

  • briguyx

    All the talk about Claire’s psychic in the wake of “What Kate Does” reminded me that many fans over the years have thought Australia is the key to “Lost.” I looked up Australian myths and found this quote from the film “The Last Wave” in the Wikipedia entry on Dreamtime:

    “Aboriginals believe in two forms of time; two parallel streams of activity. One is the daily objective activity, the other is an infinite spiritual cycle called the ‘dreamtime’, more real than reality itself. Whatever happens in the dreamtime establishes the values, symbols, and laws of Aboriginal society. It was believed that some people of unusual spiritual powers had contact with the dreamtime.”

    Sound familiar? Maybe if Jack’s surgery on Locke in the LA timeline is successful, Locke will finally go on his walkabout and enter the dreamtime world…

    • greg dharma

      this is interesting too, since the walkabout was mentioned. we havent seen much references to aborigines, but iw as thinking the 815 timeline is kind of a dreamtime since stuff happens which doesnt follow logic or reason, like ethan showing up or claire taking a ride from cabjacking Kate. however, it may be a stretch to be stranded on an island with female rambo zombies and shapeshifting smoke immortals “daily objective activity.”

  • popo

    “My question is this – if the timelines are parallel and equal in weight, then why are these deja vu’s NOT happening on the Island? Save for Juliet communicating, through Miles, that “it worked”, there seem to be no other examples of the 815 timeline bleeding over to the Island timeline.”

    Because the Islanders don’t think it’s weird when they see each other—they’ve been doing it this entire freaking time. When Kate sees Jack in the “LA timeline”, she thinks to herself “he looks familiar, where could I have seen him before [put crazy look on face]”. When Kate sees Jack on the island, she thinks “oh look, it’s Jack again, I wonder what he wants this time”. It’s not that difficult to comprehend.

    “Futhermore, the events happening in the 815 timeline seem to be occuring before they did in the Island timeline. Most notably Claire and Ethan have their medical adventures on day one instead of later, like on the Island; it is as if the past events of the Island timeline are affecting the future of the 815 timeline.”

    How the hell do you figure that the events on the island timeline are affecting the 815 timeline? That part of your argument in no way, shape, or form logically follows the first part of this quote.

    This is a trash post.

    • Darlton

      Are you always such a rude jackass?

      • popo

        Only when I read crap like this.

  • Fred Norris

    Ok you have to use your head and think people…I will give you now a definitive answer as to why it cannot be an alternate universe. The Oceanic 815ers HAVE TO COME TO THE ISLAND in both universes. Why? Because they have to in order to set off Jughead. If they don’t come to the island, they dont set off the bomb causing an impossible loop that means an alternate reality where they never go the island is an impossibility.

    Therefore the ONLY explanations for what is happening is either that the Jughead explosion has somehow ‘split’ time and the parallel timeline is concurrently taking place with the events on the island, or these are some form of flashforwards that occur after the events of the finale.

    • Cronue

      It’s obvious these aren’t flash-forwards. This isn’t after the finale. That option isn’t even on the table.

      • Fred Norris

        What are you talking about? Well obviously I mean that its a flashforward in the sense that we assume that somehow they manage to go back in time at the end and everyone’s revived etc.

    • The Landies coming to the Island? With Goodspeed’s appearance, I agree. We know he was on the Island. What Others have we seen in this sideways reality©?

      And what about Ben? He was about teenage age (?) wasn’t he, when he went into the Temple? And somehow I don’t think Richard intended to evacuate the Island like Dharma was doing (and how would he???).

      So if we see Ben in this sideways reality© I’d almost bet it’s probable the Landies© go to the Island, where Aaron, better known as MIB, will be born and return home…©

      • Fred Norris

        You sound like a freakish nerd, but ill clear up my post for you. I mean that in both timelines they have to have ALREADY COME TO THE ISLAND. An alternate reality is just not possible for the reason i already gave.

      • Nick Turner

        “With Goodspeed’s appearance, I agree. We know he was on the Island.”

        He wasn’t on the island, he was evacuated with his mommy.

        • He was on the Island in ’77. Yes, he evacuated. But he has a history with Dharma…which possibly still exists, although not likely. Certainly possible he knows of the Island.

        • Uncle Beaver

          So… Ethan is supposed to be 27 years old when we first see him on the Island. He must be aging super-fast, while Richard Alpert doesn’t age at all.

    • wnt2kno

      It looks like the only way to come to the island now is with a salvage vessel — its all underwater in the alt universe.

  • dp2

    For what it’s worth, the deju vu moments that are occurring in the LA X timeline remind me a lot of “Flashes Before Your Eyes”. I suspect that that episode — somehow — is the model for what’s happening, although that model doesn’t give an explanation for the significant changes in character and island history.

  • greg dharma

    this is too easy: the alt-timeline is 2004; the island is 2007. so it’s a case of deja vu, not preja vu. the 2004 events are effected by island events around the same time, not by future events three years later, which havent yet happened in 2004. at best one could have a future premonition of what might transpire in the future, but for time to be fluid and malleable (i.e with free will/choice, not rigid, unchanging destiny/fate), the future can’t influence the present or change the past, except if you time-travel and wear skinny ties. however the present can be influenced by the past–as well as parallel dimensions. hope that’s claire, er, clear.

    • Fred Norris

      Why are none of you asses reading my post. There can be no alternate timeline.

      • Cronue

        Don’t be a dick.

  • Dharma77

    The way I see it is, is that these are different timelines (duh!) but like Darlton say, they genuinely are played out as if its the only timeline our Losties have been in. With that said, I think they still have memories of the whole island “drama” shall we say, and whilst I don’t think they remember it fully I reckon it will be Desmond that will be involved in tying these two timelines up. The only reason I have for this, is his appearance on 815 – which which pretty darn weird, right?

  • brent

    I think many of the passengers of 815 flashed off of the plane immediately prior to the crash so that they would survive and as a direct result of the detonation of jughead. Desmond may have caused the crash but they survived because they had to be there to detonate the bomb. It’s a loop. I think that seasons 1-5 actually closes the jughead loop.

  • John Burger

    Its not Alternate

    Its quite easy to guys are not thinking about the dialog. Here’s a clue…”He kills children..if anyone deserves another go-around..its sayid”

    Second chance has been the theme—do over.

    At some point on the island the Losties will have a chance for a do-over…thats why its not alternate. There memories will be wiped by the process(but obviously not good enough), they will experience life without Island influence and will then make a choice of where they want to belong. The Bomb was suppose to negate the hatch’s power and it did exactly that–if Jack didnt blow up the bomb the power wouldnt be negated and the result was a sunkin Island. So we are not seeing any effects of Jacks bomb–its a ruse.

    What we are seeing is Jacob sending them back, at a later date to come, to a world where Jack does NOT blow up the bomb. For it to be alterate–there has to be 2 Jacks, 2 Kates and so on. Thats not it. THEY actually go back in linear fashion just as they did when they time traveled before.

  • Smoke Monster

    I just came up with an interesting theory: The two parallel timelines are equal in weight, and in order to balance this equation, an equilibrium, or in this case, a “constant”, must be reached by all the main characters (specifically Jack) in order to merge the two remaining timelines into reality and prevent any of the island saga from ever occurring in the first place. The characters in the “flash sideways” all seem to meet and they all profoundly impact each others’ lives; eventually, one of them (Jack) realizes (indirectly through Desmond, who has learned how to control his time traveling abilities by Faraday) that he knows all these people, and that his constant is ironically Locke.
    Think about it: In the very first scene of ‘LA X’, Jack speaks to Desmond on the plane, and wondered about him. Desmond said he did not know him, but either a) he has successfully time traveled back to save them and as a result loses that ability and doesn’t remember the island, or b) he has successfully time traveled back to save them and is basking in the happiness of initiating actual reality for everyone. (he does look pretty happy)
    Desmond needed to find Penelope in order to stop hopping through time, and so, with Faraday’s help, has learned to control his abilities in order to help Jack merge the two timelines so they can cancel themselves out (essentially finishing what the Incident started.
    Since Desmond was not brought to the island by Jacob, he can only indirectly influence Jack. But essentially Desmond and Faraday save everyone.
    However, in order for both timelines to merge, the constant must also be found on the island as well. ENTER WALT. Walt begins to appear on the island to Jack after he meets Smocke (Smoke Monster Locke) in order to get Jack to remember who the real Locke is; Jack begins to have memories of his newfound friendship with Locke in the “flash sideways” and comes to the conclusion that Smocke is not Locke. The script now gets ironically flipped: Jack has faith in humanity while Smocke believes it is scientifically proven that human nature will never change (Man in Black). The confrontation ends with Smocke seemingly killing Jack in front of everyone, but not before Jack realizes Smocke is not the real Locke – at the same time, Jack, in the “flash sideways”, realizes Locke is his constant.
    Jack’s realization of his constant synchronizes the two timelines together, and Smoke Monster is forced to leave Locke’s hologram body and expose himself as the formless Smoke Monster (since Locke is actually dead on the island).
    Right afterward, Jack, still on the island, reawakens after seemingly dying. Jacob, who needed this all to happen, channels through Hurley that he is back. Smoke Monster responds by declaring war on everyone on the island, with the goal of killing all of them.
    SMOKE MONSTER v. FIRE MONSTER (I love that, I think this would be a nasty ending)
    Jacob instructs Jack to “turn the island” one last time in order to set things right, as Jacob’s experiment has concluded that humans can indeed change. Jacob leads Jack and everyone else to the Wheel when they are interrupted by Smoke Monster, who is blocking their path. Smoke Monster turns back into the Man in Black’s original body and the two argue – Jacob has proven to the Man in Black that humans can change for the better. The Man in Black refuses to agree with the conclusions of their “experiment” and turns back into Smoke Monster to attack the survivors.
    Jacob tells he will distract the Man in Black while Jack turns the wheel. Smoke Monster surrounds the surviving cast and gets set to kill them when loud “wildfire” noises approach (Jacob disappears). Jacob turns into Fire Monster and is darting for Smoke Monster. Smoke Monster meets Fire Monster halfway, and the two clash, rising up into the sky in a tornadic pillar of fire and ash gripped in a supernatural fight.
    The tremendous energy of the two spiritual monsters destabilize the electromagnetic energy at the center of the island, causing the island to once again rapidly skip through time in “flashes” (ala season 5). Jack falls into the cave housing the wheel, breaking his leg in the process. The rapid temporal flashes are rapidly causing all of the remaining cast members to have brain aneurysms and die. Meanwhile, Smoke Monster and Fire Monster are destroying the entire island as they twist around the sky.
    Christian appears and forces Jack to get up and turn the wheel. Christian tells Jack that he was a bad father, that he always thought Jack was a better man than he was, and says to Jack: “Please, son, take me home…” Jack agrees, and turns the wheel a final time, invalidating the island storyline by teleporting the island underwater (where no humans can find it), and thereby validating the “flash sideways” timeline into real time – as a result of Jack’s actions, the plane never crashes, the alternative storyline becomes the real storyline, and everything goes back to normal (with everyone faintly remembering their connections to each other). The island (which was needed for Jacob to teach the Man in Black a lesson regarding the “human experiment”, is no longer needed because Jacob has won the fundamental argument, and so the island settles under the ocean after the flashes finally end.
    The show ends with Jack miraculously healing Locke (in the flash sideways timeline) so that he can walk again.
    I’m leaving a lot of other little things out, but wouldn’t that be absolutely awesome? I hope the last episode is called “The Experiment” or something, as the whole point of the show was Jacob proving to the Man in Black that he is wrong in his assumption about humanity, and manipulated the entire lives of the cast members in order have them prove it once and for all (which means Jacob knew he had to die and have the Man in Black gain absolute power on the island in order to prove him wrong – ironic.
    Anyway, this is my initial insane theory about the end of the show. For some reason I think the concept of the Constant is very important and will resurface. What does everyone think? Let’s expand upon this – what are your theories????

    • Cutter XXIII

      I lost 17 million brain cells reading that. It sounds like the original, discarded ending to the Lord of the Rings. NAZGUL SLAP-FIGHT!

  • Steve. N.

    “there seem to be no other examples of the 815 timeline bleeding over to the Island timeline.”

    Rewatch LA X and pay attention around the 15 minute mark. Right after Artz is talking with Hurley we go back to the island and Hurley is leaning against the van and he says “what was that, what happened?” Jin said it was a flash of light and headache which means time travel like before (not a direct quote just a summary). Everyone seems to have missed this nugget.

    Hurley and Jin both are experiencing bleeding between the 2 timelines on the island.

  • cap10tripps

    I’d like to summarize a theory I’ve come up with. After watching “LA X” I was prompted by a blogger to watch “Flashes Before Your Eyers” for one reason. To notice the red spot of paint on Desmond’s neck and connect the dots (so to speak) with the red spot of blood on Jack’s. Here’s what I’ve come up with…

    The incident always happens, and jughead is not detonated during the incident. However it worked, because jughead is detonated by Desmond via the failsafe. This gives him the ability to stream his own consciousness through space and time. After harnessing this ability (with Faraday’s help) he streams to moments before the 815 crash while he’s on the island. However this time he doesn’t bring the plane down, and thus it worked.

    Now the grandfather paradox or Schroedinger’s cat kicks in where we have tangent universes. One where the failsafe is turned, because a faithless Locke and the 815ers crash landed and one where they didn’t. It’s my belief (as it is many of you as well) that Jack, Kate, Jin, Sawyer, Sayid, and Hurley have Desmond’s ability now. Desmond shows up in a controlled flash to take Faraday’s place in helping Jack (and subsequently the rest) grasp this ability. This will eventually create a realization of both sides of the looking glass so to speak.

    I’m still trying to fill in the blanks, but this is where I stand. There will obviously have to be resolution of some sort. Do one of the tangent universes have to be collapsed onto the other? Does one side simply have to win the war? Is it all in Hurley’s mind? Tune in Tuesday, same LOST time, same LOST channel…

    • WAxelFoley

      This is really cool and I think many people believe Desmond’s appearance on the plane signals some sort of involvement with the Island in the 815 timeline. I also like the idea that the failsafe caused the incident or split in some way. Very interesting.

  • kaptan36

    Aside from these alternate timelines, I think i remembered something of importance which could be another huge continuity mess-up by the writers. Okay, so in the 5th season episode “Dead is Dead”, Ben is confronted by the Smoke Monster who takes the shape of his daughter and tells him to help John Locke, and we just found out that the new Locke, is the man in black, who is the Smoke Monster right? Well if I’m not mistaken, wasn’t this Locke/Man in Black/Smoke Monster in the chamber above with Sun the whole time Ben was being “judged” by the Smoke Monster? Maybe I just didn’t remember correctly, or maybe there are more than smoke monster on the island, or maybe this is yet again one huge(easily avoidable) continuity screw-up by the writers. I love the show, but I hate it that Darlton is always telling us to pay attention to this and that/ and this re3lates to when this thing happened earlier; but when fans call them out on really big continuity goof-ups, their response is always something to the extent of ” people nitpick too much. It’s just a show.”

    • WAxelFoley

      Locke/MIB was alone in the upper part of the cave while Ben was being judged. The old switcheroo.

    • cap10tripps

      If you recall, Flocke yelled to Ben after he fell that he was going to get something to pull him back up. He disappears for a bit, and Smokey comes out and takes Alex’s form.

  • I think we maybe over thinking all of this a bit too much… especially considering we’ve only seen 3 of 18 hours worth of this season. None-the-less, I too have my own theories 🙂 and shall now spout it off in a vain attempt to explain something I’m not even sure I understand.

    Now, a few weeks after the season 5 finale I heard a radio interview with a theoretical physicist named Michio Kuku. You may have seen him on NOVA, and I do believe he has a show on Discovery now. He’s got a great web site devoted to a wide range of theoretical concepts in physics, including time travel… imagine that. Anyhow, when the question about the reset was posed he explained, almost verbatim, what we are now seeing as a result of “The Incident.”

    He outlined how an alternate universe (time-line) would be created instantaneously at the moment of the incident. The kicker, of course, is that the losties would be launched back into the future of their previously existing time-line with no idea that the reset did actually work. This is b/c time flows in a straight line and any event significant enough to to alter that time-line will spur an alternate universe running parallel to the first time-line.

    Important concept here – Alternate, but parallel.

    Apparently this is (theoretically) not an uncommon occurrence and it is a very real possibility that there are countless parallel realities to our own running their course unbeknownst to anyone in our own universe.

    With that said, isn’t it possible that the only reconciliation between the two time-lines could be far less dramatic than we are all speculating? Take the mirror in the light house, for instance: we have all read that Jack sees something in it. Isn’t it totally plausible that he is able to catch a glimpse of the other time-line? What better way for Jacob to prove that Jack has found his destiny and that Faraday was right (at least kind of right)?

    I’d be interested to see what you guys have to say…

    • cap10tripps

      My post below was in response to yours. For some reason the reply button eluded me…

  • cap10tripps

    I actually haven’t read anything about Jack seeing something in the mirror of the light house (do you mean the lamp post station?), but I’m wanting to check into that right about now. It’s definitely plausible that both parallels continue to exist with the idea that one (non crash) is simply used to prove that Jack did save them and Faraday was right, but that’s just not in the fashion of LOST. There will probably be more to it than that.

    I believe that the incident did work, but not until Desmond set off jughead via the failsafe. Your theory seems to have more weight behind it at the moment, but I’m stickin to my guns. To me your ideas vs. mine vs. someone elses are the greatest part of this show. It’s created a community that speaks on such things with a greater knowledge of the hypothesized unknown. Fuckin love it.

    • Hey cap… first off, not sure if the name is in reference to JG, but if so i LOVE the dead 🙂 Anyway, I’m almost positive I read something about Jack peering into the mirror in the lighthouse, definitely not the lamp post. Of course, I read SO much about this show I could just be confused. Regardless, I agree, the best part of the show is the community it has spawned and I’m pretty confident that whatever the outcome of this season is we’re all going to miss it. Fucking love it too bro…